Curse

Grasping Darkness · Apr 23, 2007, 12:23 PM // 12:23

yea fish I agree and it was so funny last night when I tried an O L D school farm spot at the gates of kryta where a mergoyle power blocked my earth ele tank so I had to unflag my henchys to res me so I could get to the lightning drakes which owned me /no sarcasm im enjoying it

oh noes I just remembered I gave away a 20% vs charr bow string the other day I could have got a few gp for now I bet

Takeko Nakano · Apr 23, 2007, 12:24 PM // 12:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Illuminus

Takeko Nakano, this thread was opened to thank ANet for adding Hard Mode.. i dont really see any connection between this one and the one you linked.

Err, I dunno - maybe the fact it's about feedback on HM so if people want to say thanks they can say it there?

Anna Ryan · Apr 23, 2007, 12:35 PM // 12:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrick Smit

This is a typicall example of a generic, but to my opinion a "wrong" approach or reaction to hardmode. Instead it should have induced how to beat a monk not by sheer firepower, but by including skills that will detroy the monks effectiveness, diversion, shame, mark of subversion, E-denial (which only seems to work on players but not mobs), basic interupts, daze (BHA, headbutt-->plague touch, whatever) etc.

*cough* for your information I had Norgu with Diversion, Power Block etc. The monk boss itself wasn't a problem but the fact that we couldn't kill any of the mob around him, which had 2 Rt's and 3 ele afflicted...

SotiCoto · Apr 23, 2007, 12:57 PM // 12:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grasping Darkness

yea fish I agree and it was so funny last night when I tried an O L D school farm spot at the gates of kryta where a mergoyle power blocked my earth ele tank so I had to unflag my henchys to res me so I could get to the lightning drakes which owned me /no sarcasm im enjoying it

You enjoy getting your arse handed to you in-game?

... Is that entirely normal?

I hate it.
I hate that feeling that I'm putting time and effort into it and getting nothing out because I keep dying. I realised long ago that if I can't do something then I'm better off not wasting my time on it....

The problem is now that Hard Mode is half of the entirety of PvE (and DOES contain things that I cannot get in Normal Mode) .... and then there are the Elite Missions on the side that I can't hope to do even in Normal Mode... Which means essentially that the majority of Guild Wars falls into the category of things I can't do no matter how hard I try.... and thus probably shouldn't bother with.
It is honestly a miracle that I haven't totally given up on it yet.

Grasping Darkness · Apr 23, 2007, 01:14 PM // 13:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

You enjoy getting your arse handed to you in-game?

No. That was just something unexpected first go in an area. Did some 4 man hard mode with my heros in fow last night. After I learn the tricks to whatever it's a pushover.

mikkel · Apr 23, 2007, 01:20 PM // 13:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

The best part is that HM doesn’t add more mobs to an area or make creatures over-powered.

Heh, yeah, 'cause halving cast and recharge time for all skills and boosting movement and attack speed by 50% is so insignificant a change that it can hardly be described as "overpowered"!

The past two years, almost all of the focus has been on skill balancing, trying to perfect it with minute changes in skills. Hard Mode completely throws all of this work out the window by effectively doubling the potential of every single skill in the game for mobs. Seems rather counter-productive and lazy to me.

SotiCoto · Apr 23, 2007, 01:27 PM // 13:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grasping Darkness

No. That was just something unexpected first go in an area. Did some 4 man hard mode with my heros in fow last night. After I learn the tricks to whatever it's a pushover.

I wish I knew how you did it....
As the only parts of the game I find a pushover are the areas before you reach level 20... with a level 20 character.
I can still get party-wiped in Normal Mode Bukdek Byway if I'm not concentrating.... and that is with an AI party that can rip Nightfallen Jahai to pieces when I AM concentrating..... and not getting server-lagged.

Did I mention that server-lag is my account's second most prominant cause of death? My average ping is over 1000.
[The first is death-levelling Charr with my warrior in Pre-Searing.]

-_-;

But then I can hardly blame lag for all of it.
I can also blame my dyspraxia for giving me lousy reflexes...

freekedoutfish · Apr 23, 2007, 01:27 PM // 13:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

I know HOW to get to Hard Mode...

SotiCoto your basing you're entire view of HM from the perspective of NightFall. Im not surprised you dislike it.

NightFall (or more accurately ROT in NightFall) is an extremely frustrating place. I agree about that and I dislike it to high-heaven.

But thats only 5% of the entire game. There are two other campaigns which exist, which dont have frustratingly hard content like NF.

HM in those games is fun. But I think your slightly over-exagerating to say that NF is impossible to complete. It may be tough and it may be frustrating, but it can be done.

I was close to crying at how frustrated I was with NF when I played it after prophercies and factions. And I do have a big flashy title (which Ok I like to show off as people keep telling me), so that just shows that titles mean nothing.

You must only be about 3 missions away from completing NF if your in the ROT?

Once you get past that, your ready to play HM. My advice (if your finding NF too hard) is to get away from it and play factions or Prophercies.

If you havent already played those games, and you jumped head-first into NF, then you chose the wrong way to experience the game.

You just picked the harder of all 3 games, to start on. Im not surprised you feel isolated. And NF is the worst of all 3 games to get a PUG in. If you travelled over to Prophercies and factions, I expect you'd have an easier time finding PUGs for normal modes and/or you could hench your way through the game alot easier.

I wish you luck with NF.

Takeko Nakano · Apr 23, 2007, 01:37 PM // 13:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

But thats only 5% of the entire game. There are two other campaigns which exist, which dont have frustratingly hard content like NF.

HM in those games is fun. But I think your slightly over-exagerating to say that NF is impossible to complete. It may be tough and it may be frustrating, but it can be done.

I actually enjoyed Nightfall - I didn't mind the frustrating aspects of it, because it was still doable.

However, I think Hard Mode in Prophecies (I don't know about Factions) is still unbalanced in early areas and needs refining. I'm sure Nightfall is very, very difficult in HM.

SotiCoto · Apr 23, 2007, 01:56 PM // 13:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

SotiCoto your basing you're entire view of HM from the perspective of NightFall. Im not surprised you dislike it.

NightFall (or more accurately ROT in NightFall) is an extremely frustrating place. I agree about that and I dislike it to high-heaven.

But thats only 5% of the entire game. There are two other campaigns which exist, which dont have frustratingly hard content like NF.

HM in those games is fun. But I think your slightly over-exagerating to say that NF is impossible to complete. It may be tough and it may be frustrating, but it can be done.

I was close to crying at how frustrated I was with NF when I played it after prophercies and factions. And I do have a big flashy title (which Ok I like to show off as people keep telling me), so that just shows that titles mean nothing.

You must only be about 3 missions away from completing NF if your in the ROT?

Once you get past that, your ready to play HM. My advice (if your finding NF too hard) is to get away from it and play factions or Prophercies.

If you havent already played those games, and you jumped head-first into NF, then you chose the wrong way to experience the game.

You just picked the harder of all 3 games, to start on. Im not surprised you feel isolated. And NF is the worst of all 3 games to get a PUG in.

-_-;

The only real mistake which could be counted as "diving right in" I did was making my primary character (my first and most played) an Assassin.

I'll have you know that he has Protector of Cantha, Protector of Tyria, Canthan Grandmaster Cartographer (and Tyrian Cartographer, well on its way up), Canthan Elite Skill Hunter... ALMOST Tyrian Elite Skill Hunter (just the Hell's Precipice skills to go)...
... And has reached the Gate of Madness in NF and got totally pwned by Shiro once there already (annoying me rather since I prepared my entire team build around beating him).

What frustrates me is that NONE of that was too easy for me.
Every single one of those titles WAS a challenge for me and I could still have been entertained doing it if they were easier [though admittedly, my progress toward getting the surprisingly rare Legendary Defender of Ascalon title is easy as pie, as being a stubborn bastard is my one strength]. I have tried going into the Underworld.... not to get ectoplasm (I don't kid myself into thinking I could get a single one)... but just to see how long I could survive before my inevitable death. I couldn't even kill ONE ENEMY (though admittedly the first enemy I came across was a BA).

... And now.... as if all my straining at something that many people said was "too easy" wasn't enough...... the entirety of Hard Mode has been added, consisting of the same crap I've already done but giving the enemies cheats.... and several titles have been linked into it... titles that other people will be able to get but I know I won't.
It cheapens every day of solid gaming I have been through in order to get what I have managed so far... Even my Canthan Grandmaster Cartographer title I only wear now because it is physically long and stretches my text box. And by the time I get "Kind of a Big Deal" by the original means (3 protector, 2 gmc)... EVERYONE will have it through different routes... and it will mean absolutely NOTHING.

You know what?
The Realm of Torment isn't all that bad.... relatively speaking.
I know if I grind Nightfallen Jahai enough for Lightbringer Points that I'll get my rank high enough to be fairly toughened against the Torment Creatures.... I'm almost at Rank 5 now, and given how quick that was [and not over the weekend either, where I couldn't play due to the monumental lag] I'll be at Rank 6 before too long as well, giving me -6 damage reduction, +30% damage and serious AoE spread on Lightbringer's Gaze.

But I will not be able to manage in Hard Mode.
I've tried it in Minister Cho's Estate... and it scared the hell out of me. I know how to handle enemies with clever skill-bars... but I can't cope with enemies that run faster, hit harder and have more health. It is just obscene. If I wanted to fight enemies like that, I'd just take on normal mode with a -60% Death Penalty.

Wtf Its A Monk · Apr 23, 2007, 02:04 PM // 14:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

Well congratulations on having a NASA computer, 100mbit connection, viper reflexes, total awareness of your surroundings, and nigh-on-telepathic synergy with other people. But for the record... not everyone has that... and just because you don't find it hard doesn't mean there aren't countless people struggling just to try and keep up for whatever reason.
Perhaps when you're done you'd like to go to Ethiopia and eat chocolate-bars in front of starving children.

1. My computer is 1 year old and I have bargain basement DSL (256kb dl/128kb ul) I think you were right on the viper reflexes and total awareness of my surroundings...but i wish i had nigh-on-telepathic synergy

2. If you come into a thank you thread not to thank but to randomly flame people who actually like the feature then expect to get flamed back.

3. I realize that there are people out there who have trouble with it....because I am in a helpful guild where people are constantly asking and recieving help.

4. The point of my post was to point out that lightbringer is not a requirement to finish nightfall and not a personal attack on you at all....as i think you took it based on your reply.

5. Sit down take a few deep breaths and try not to get too angry with people who you dont even know....cause teh internets is serious business

freekedoutfish · Apr 23, 2007, 02:20 PM // 14:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

-_-;

Ouch at being a Sin. I feel your pain. Since the introduced Factions, ive seen maybe 2 decent Assassin players. All the rest (from my perspective) have been awfull.

Only because most sings think their warriors and hurl themselves into Agro and die within seconds and you stand there thinking "why did we bring a Sin"!

I can't imagine its been easy taking one through all 3 campaigns, or persuading people to add you to groups.

Unfortunately thats the stigmata of Sins. Because 95% of players cant use them properly, they have a bad name. But Kudos to you for striving foward and using one.

I would say "maybe start a new char and take them into hardmode", but I expect this Sin is your main char and you have pride for it like I do my Ele.

I wish you luck with getting him through to the end of NF and getting into HM.

But im sure HM couldnt be that hard for a Sin. Your distruption skills would come in handy for preventing the numerious mesma degen skills in HM?

(You can tell I have no experience with Sin skills, my knowledge goes as far as Ele's, Rits, Rangers and Necros)!

Besides HM will probably get a nerf within the next few days, after Anet has a chance to see how it plays out. At the minute it is slightly over-powered, but you have to expect that from something new like this.

SotiCoto · Apr 23, 2007, 03:03 PM // 15:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wtf Its A Monk

1. My computer is 1 year old and I have bargain basement DSL (256kb dl/128kb ul) I think you were right on the viper reflexes and total awareness of my surroundings...but i wish i had nigh-on-telepathic synergy

Meh... Half-right isn't bad.
Now let me mention that there aren't many things in life that phase me... but when it comes to the interaction of my Dyspraxia (genetically inferior hand-eye coordination, essentially) and Guild Wars... I get REALLY bugged.

Quote:

2. If you come into a thank you thread not to thank but to randomly flame people who actually like the feature then expect to get flamed back.

When one has got used to 90% of anything they say, regardless of intent, causing a flame-war.... one starts to become far less caring of whether one is actually being an arsehole or not. When you'd gone through as many phases of desperately trying to be polite and failing inexplicably as I have... you probably wouldn't even try any more either.

Quote:

3. I realize that there are people out there who have trouble with it....because I am in a helpful guild where people are constantly asking and recieving help.

And I've had enough bad luck with guilds that I turned Ronin... and when that resulted in my getting spammed by recruiters, I made my own solo-guild. Did I mention I don't have ANY friends who play Guild Wars? [Did I mention I don't have friends full stop, though it doesn't cause me any trouble anywhere else?]

Quote:

4. The point of my post was to point out that lightbringer is not a requirement to finish nightfall and not a personal attack on you at all....as i think you took it based on your reply.

What you basically expressed was that you could do it without Lightbringer ranks.... and essentially implied that I am sub-par for needing them. Whether you intended it that way or not.... well... I honestly don't care as people take me out of context all the bloody time.

Quote:

5. Sit down take a few deep breaths and try not to get too angry with people who you dont even know....cause teh internets is serious business

I think I'm going to have to come up with a whole new lexicon for my own personal forms of expression.... Angry is what I get when I get wiped by enemies that I should theoretically be able to wipe myself without trouble. What I'm getting here is less "angry" and more a combination of disbelief that other people have it so differently and tedium that everyone else is so set on making life more difficult for both themselves and every other person who ever wanted to get somewhere.

HalPlantagenet · Apr 23, 2007, 03:06 PM // 15:06

On the general topic, I want to correct my previous position on HM in the other thread. There I was generally positive. After a weekend I have to revise my opinion to highly enthusiastic. Some guild mates and I spent an hour on the rescuing Koss quest in Elona last night in HM and regularly found ourselves napping in black and white in the fortress mostly because of the infuriating priest who kites as if he were a human player. To succeed required careful analysis of the Kournan builds, some innovative strategies and distractions and good timing. GW hasn't been this much fun in months. So well done. I even enjoy knowing that some of the quests my not even be completable in their current state.

I recognize that that kind of experience isn't fun for some players, but then there is an alternative to HM, isn't there.

PS Kudos on the new, most excellent 15K Knight's Armor. My only complaint is that I didn't receive a token to exchange for it as a reward for being a diligent player for nearly two years. A bug perhaps?

Theus · Apr 23, 2007, 03:14 PM // 15:14

I'm all for the current Hardmode additions.

But what I'm wondering if whether or not the gimping of Henchmen/Hero AI is a part of Hard mode.If so,I'm agaisnt it.I'm all for buffing the enemys ability to fight me(Whether it be Faster movement,Attack speed,or Cast speed or High armor/HP.),but not for gimping my ability to fight them.

But all in all its been a pretty positive experience.

EternalTempest · Apr 23, 2007, 03:22 PM // 15:22

The mobs are a lot smarter. As an ele, I had a charr Mesmer focus on me and the monk with Backfire and chaos storms. I've switched to Air Spike / Earth wards (from fire ele) due to HM scatter from AOE.

I love HM, the challenges, and the evolution my this has forced me to do with my character, my builds, my hero builds are getting much more research / trial / error then before. It's making me a better player.

@OP -> I agree with what you've said about HM.

inscribed · Apr 23, 2007, 03:52 PM // 15:52

Hard mode is fantastic. Its challenging, the stronger mobs really force you to think about skill selection, and when you finally beat a mission or area, it feels like something has been accomplished. Going through Old Ascalon again for the first time in a long time with all of the level 20+ mobs was a blast.

I also like the farming changes. I do quite a bit of solo farming, and this update has made it EASIER to do my runs. No more scattering in AoE, no more drop reducing from rezoning into an area a lot, its like solo farming use to be when the game first came out. Who cares if the white drops aren't as good, farming green weapons is quite a bit easier now, I'm getting more gold runes now than I ever was before, and the runs are much, much quicker now since none of the mobs run from AoE. Anyone complaining about any 'farming nerfs' really should be slapped.

Coming to these forums lately has been a real drag. Its the same few people going to every thread complaining about dumb stuff. Hard mode is great, and every time I see a group of people talking about in an outpost ingame, its the same positive comments. The naysayers need to realize that, however vocal you might be on the forums, you are the minority. The problem isn't with the game, its a problem on the player's part.

Bryant Again · Apr 23, 2007, 04:00 PM // 16:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

The only real mistake which could be counted as "diving right in" I did was making my primary character (my first and most played) an Assassin.

You shouldn't be punished for rolling something that looks appealing to you. The fact that other classes are excluded based on the PvE mechanics is, in my opinion, a much larger problem than anything else present in Guild Wars.

HalPlantagenet · Apr 23, 2007, 04:24 PM // 16:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theus

...But what I'm wondering if whether or not the gimping of Henchmen/Hero AI is a part of Hard mode.

I can't imagine that it is. Dunkoro in particular, even set to passive, is positively suicidal in the early Tyrian missions. I'm forced to flag him constantly. One small benefit for me: my flagging skills have improved significantly in the last three days.